Transcript of AE 1101 - Interview: 109 Days Alone in the Australian Outback with Anthony Elorrioroz

G'day, you mob. Pete here, your host. Welcome to this episode of Aussie English, today is an interview episode where I have the absolute pleasure of interviewing my friend Anthony Elorrioroz. So, he is originally from France, he moved out to Australia, I think about 8, 10 years ago, actually, and he has done so much since coming to Australia. He came over here on a working holiday visa.

He ended up getting his PR. He got sponsored. He then got his citizenship. So, we talk about that and what that process was like, studying for the IELTS, how he learnt English because he ended up coming to Australia with very little English.

And then more recently, he's been travelling all over the place through Australia. He ended up escaping from New South Wales just before the borders originally were closed during COVID and went on an amazing 109-day motorbike solo tour of the interior of Australia. He did a heap. He since went on a 1,600-kilometre bike ride on a bike-bike this time, not a motorbike, around Tasmania.

So, it's an absolutely awesome interview, I think you're going to get a lot out of it. And he shares his tips with you guys, too, if you're thinking about doing these kinds of adventures when coming Down Under. So, without any further ado, guys, slap the bird, and let's get into it.

(Both speaking French)

How are you going, dude?

...In French.

No. Man, fuck that. It'd be a short conversation if we were speaking in French.

Already? You're still practising, no?

No, I haven't in a long time, like I can- It's weird. It's one of those things where I can hear and understand most things, but because I haven't had anyone to speak it with in so long the- What is it you say? (speaking French)

Yeah.

It just completely disappears. And Portuguese, because I speak... Eu falo português em casa agora ...I speak Portuguese at home...

Yeah.

...It's just taken over. And so, like, as soon as I was speaking Portuguese all the time, it started- If I tried to speak French, Portuguese would enter and try and take over. And so, it was so embarrassing because a lot of the time I would meet people and be like, you know... (Speaking French) ...And they'd be like, wow, you've got a great accent, you must speak really well. And then I'd be like... (Speaking French) ...Fuck.

Oh, you did. You did. Like, I remember when we were chatting back in Melbourne, we could like talk for hours and hours.

I know, well, it was fine. And that's the weird thing- The amazing thing with language is how quickly it disappears.

If you stop practising and using it, it's...

Yeah, it atrophies. It's like going to the gym, I think, right.

Exactly.

Yeah, you don't reali- And it's happened to me, like, my muscles- Since becoming a dad. So, anyway, shall we get into it?

Yeah, sure. Sure.

And how do I pronounce your surname? I always-

That's-

Is there a shortcut to it?

Elorrioroz.

Elorrioroz.

Yeah, perfect.

So, it'd be like, Elorrioroz in Australian English, right? All right, let's do it. G'day, you mob. How's it going? Welcome to this episode of Aussie English. Today I have Anthony Elorrioroz on the podcast. I had to get in quick, he just told me how to pronounce his name correctly. So, I'm like, I've got to say it fast. I've got to say it fast.

Say it now! Say it now!

So, Anthony is originally from France, and we would have met in, I think, probably 2013-14. When did you come to Melbourne?

Yeah. Well, it was 2013. Yeah.

Yeah, so you were living across the road in a share house.

I was. Yeah, I was across the road till about 2015, for a couple years, I think.

Yeah.

...That's when we met. Yeah, yeah.

Yeah. So, we were living on- It was Dryburgh Street, right, in North Melbourne.

Well, yeah, Flemington Road for me and you were in the next street. Yeah.

Yeah. Anyway, so I wanted to get you on because you have been, besides, obviously, you know, we can talk about your migration story to Australia and learning English and getting used to everything. You've been on some really, really incredible trips that I've kind of been perving on during lockdown and everything in Victoria here.

Yeah, definitely.

Do you want to start with how and why you ended up deciding to come to Australia from France?

Yeah. It all started- I don't know. I think I was- I was 21 at the time, you know, so I just wanted to go and see something different. And I was looking at options at the time and probably America or like- The main point was an English country to try to learn English. And then I think at the time, we ended up we were friends being like, oh, why not Australia?

And seems easy, like, you can get the working holiday visa for a year, which is very good if you want to learn a language. And yeah, that's all. I ended up in Australia. What was supposed to be a year of working, holiday, travelling and backpacking around ended up being 8 and a half years now, so.

8 and a half years, yeah. So, and is there any-? What would you say? Is there any will to go home ever or Australia is your home now? Because sometimes you meet people who've come and done the working holiday visa- Like Margit, our friend Margit, right, where she sort of had plans of kind of staying in Australia, potentially long term.

And then on a dime, she's just like, yeah, moving to Norway, you know? And so, it's almost like she has one foot in Australia and one back in Europe. She was originally from Estonia, but yeah.

I think you always have one specific area to, you know, to just be like- People always ask me even more when I'm travelling, like I've been doing the last year. People are very curious being like, oh, so Australia is your home, you're going to stay there forever. And you're like, well, forever, it's a big, big statement, you know? It's- I don't know. I like it so far and I don't see myself going back home.

Do you have PR? Permanent residency, now or...?

A citizen.

A citizen. Wow. Okay, sweet. Well, you can go home whenever you want, right? And then...

So, I can go, yeah- Oh, not with COVID lately, but.

Not cheaply.

Not cheaply, and not with what happened in Australia last year. But yeah, no, I can go back home, but it's, you know, it's always the thing you- You don't know. Like in 5, 10 years, family could, you know, make you want to go back more, spend more time in France or- But at least I got the freedom, I guess, now to go and back...

Yeah.

...The dual citizenship. So, it's a good thing.

That must be a pretty enviable place to be for most people that are- Well, most French people coming to Australia, right? The people you interact with and you're just like, yeah, I'm already a citizen...

Yeah, exactly. And when you met people from, like, I've met a few people, few people who've been backpacking, so they're on their second-year visa trying their best to find a sponsor or find like the way to stay here longer. And they're like, well, what're you doing? And I'm like, I've been here 8 years. They're like, what!?

Yeah, I don't have to worry about shit, I can get on Centrelink. I can get on Centrelink if I want, the government will pay me. So, what did you have to do? When you came out you obviously did the one year working holiday visa thing.

So, I got here and after a few months I found a job, at some diesel mechanic like mining industry kind of. And I found a job with a company and after- The working holiday visa at that time was you can't work more than 6 months with the same company.

That's right. I remember you had to- A lot of our friends, including, I think yourself had to move, right?

Yeah.

Stay somewhere for 6 months and then, oh, I've got to go interstate because I've got a job somewhere else.

Well, it's mainly the company itself, so you can't be contracted with the same company for more than 6 months. So, it could be 6 months in Melbourne, but if you want to go further, longer, I mean, it's kind of the- You need to change company, pretty much.

Yeah. So, you could work at that time, at least with the next-door neighbour's company...

Yeah.

...You know, across the road, but you had to switch.

You have to switch the contract and not be in the same company. But I ended up- The company ended up offering a sponsorship like pretty quickly, actually after a few months in it. So, that's, you know...

Boom!

...7 months in Australia, everything was pretty. I was like, yes, I'll get it.

So, what did you have to do? Was it- Was it just, you know, chance, serendipity that they had the opportunity to give you that visa or...?

Yeah, I think they had the- I think they were pretty- That they've been sponsoring all the people in the past, so that wasn't something scary for them. And then you just got to- Like it's a contract for three years at that time, for four years, I think. And you just need to get the visa approval, so you've got to do the IELTS test. And then pretty much pay the money and show them you're qualified.

So, I was qualified from all my diploma back in France to do that job. So, they kind of need to prove then- They've been offering that job to Australian people. But nobody answers pretty much and you have the quality to do the job...

Is that to sort of prevent companies from only offering jobs to foreigners, you would assume because they can potentially underpay them?

Exactly.

Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

So, yeah, that was the point there.

So, how did you prepare for the IELTS exam? Did you already have a pretty good level of English prior to coming?

No, no. No, I was like...

Tell us that journey.

That was- Yeah. So, getting it was a funny part, because you- I learnt for 7-8 years in France, but you learn there at the school.

That sounds like my French journey at school, it was like, oh yeah, I did 6 years, but I probably, when I started studying again, as you'll probably remember, I got to a point where I was fluent. But it took probably three months of self-study to get past what six years had taught me at school.

Exactly. And the will wasn't there for my first, probably 5-6 years. I was very much like, why do you want me to speak English like that?

Yeah.

I don't need to. And then once I start to realise it'll be good and I was interested in it, you all like switched. But when I got here, I could barely order coffee, you know, it was like, hey, how are you? My name is Anthony. I've got two sisters, two brothers and that's it.

Man, my- Sorry to interrupt you. I have to tell this story. So, Margit was a mutual friend of ours. She was from Estonia, came over to Australia, and I was living with an Estonian named Richard. I think he's been on the podcast. And they had a group of Estonian friends.

I'd never met so many Estonians in my life after, you know, meeting Richard. I think I probably ended up, you know, getting to know 10 of them and 3 or 4 of them I still talk to on a regular basis. But there was one guy that came over with zero English, and I remember they had this situation where he went into a coffee, a cafe to get coffee.

And I think he just walked up to the person at the till to buy the coffee and just said, want coffee. And he was huge, he was like 6 foot something, you know, a really massive guy. And the woman was just like, Jesus Christ, like take it. Don't pay for it, just leave. But I remember that he had no English and all he knew was just, coffee. Want coffee.

Yeah. And you go to Australia, and like there's so many choices of coffee, so they're probably like, what?

I know. Yeah, exactly. Don't ask, just give him whatever...

Just whatever, just a long black.

So, what did you do in order to sort of get your English to the level it's at now, obviously where you...?

Well, I started to take an English course for 6-7 months. So, I ended up, I think- I went on Gumtree, I think at that time and went looking for a teacher.

Yeah. And I ended up finding like an American backpacker was offering like probably a one-on-one course. So, I would go like at least twice, what, twice, three times a week. And I think like it was like one on one will talk to you about- Like she was very invested in it, so she would always set up stuff about what I like, and we'll just chat for an hour, or we just work over like an article or news or something like that.

And from then we started to study a lot about, you know, IELTS, a lot of technical. So, they- There's a procedure they want you to follow.

Yeah.

And once you've been doing a few tests from the previous years, you kind of understand where to go, what's the rules there and...

What they think you should answer, what they're looking for.

...Looking for, like and so that's pretty much how I have been getting ready for it. But it was very useful, like after, yeah, after 6 months almost of 2-3 hours a week of that private lesson and next to that, I was going to work, so I'll just speak with Australian or Irish people at that time, a lot.

And listening to the radio in the car, you know, on the way to work. You don't- At first, it's very like foggy. It's like you hear a lot of things you don't understand...

It's almost like being blind, right? And then you slowly learn to see, and things come into focus. And it's almost like a patchiness all over the place, you kind of have to get comfortable, right?

...One word a day, and you're like, okay, I think I understand now. Or watching movie, watching movie with English subtitles.

Yeah.

You read a lot at the beginning, but then start to fade a little bit. And you realise without the thing it's- Yeah, without realising it you just- Your vocab just goes up the roof...

I think especially if you're absorbing that much, right, if you're just watching movies, watching TV or listening to the radio and- That's one of the biggest things I found with a lot of my followers that talk to me, they'll be like, I've been in Australia for 5 years and my English is still horrible.

And when you get down, when you dig in, it turns out, oh, well, you know, they're speaking Farsi all the time or Persian with their family and friends and their whole friendship network are all, you know, Iranian Persians who speak it and you're just like, the trouble is, you need to get out of this. You need to affect- It's just time spent, you know, on task...

Because you can't, and that's the thing you can't. It's something I thought I would do at the beginning. So, when I first took on the job, I was with another French friend, with who I came to Australia. And were like, oh, you know what? We're just going to make it happen, we'll chat in English together, even if it's just us.

Nah. Cos that didn't happen at all. You know, you'll try a bit one day, two days and after it's like, just stick in French.

Well, your brain wants to pick the least difficult. Yeah, the easy way. Exactly. So, how did you go with IELTS? Did you have to do it multiple times? Or was it just a once off and you smashed it and you never had to do it again or?

I smashed it, but I got it from the first time.

Good.

...For that visa it was, you need to get over 5, so it's over... They noted on 10...

Yeah.

...And you need to get at least 5 for each section.

Yeah.

So, you got listening, reading, speaking...

Writing.

...Writing. So- And if you got 5 or over for each of them you good, which I did.

Awesome.

Yeah. But I think it's, yeah, all the 3-4 months of just doing test and test and test and test, so.

So, was it the most important thing there was just becoming familiar with previous exam examples for IELTS and practising them, and then, you know, it wasn't so much, I just go to work, and I work on my English there? It's, no, I have to specifically sit down and look at the exam?

Yeah, I think that at that time was like mainly just try to focus to get the test because the test was the open gate to the visa and everything. So, the- My focus wasn't necessarily on- I mean, you still learn English in the process because I was starting from scratch, but it was mainly like learning the procedure of the test to get it done and passed it, so. But it worked, so.

How did you go getting used to Australian English? This was something I was always like, you know, when I was learning French, it was French, French and within that it was kind of Parisian French, right. So, you know, I wasn't learning slang from other regions or the different sort of accents and dialects there. But I always- The idea of going somewhere like, say, Quebec, right, and trying to communicate with Quebecois.

They speak French, but it's relatively different, right? And it's quite a shock. So, did you have that kind of experience coming to Australia where you'd probably been exposed to British and American English, but very little Australian English? Or did you sort of practise a bit with Australian English before coming?

Oh, I didn't practise at all. I just...

Jumped in.

...And jumped in. And the thing is, you know, that's the- Some people always said to me back in France, you'll see Australian, they got different accents, different slang. But when you first got here and I think for my case, like when I first got here, it was just your brain, like you say, just blocks everything.

Yeah.

And it's just like it's another language you don't understand. I couldn't speak- Like if someone was speaking to me, I couldn't speak if it was American, Irish, Australian, British. Like it was just, what are they saying? You know?

I had that when we were in Paris, when I was doing my trip, when I was probably 16. I remember walking into the hotel we were staying at and the concierge or the guy running the place was chatting to some woman. And I was just like, I'm like, what the fuck is going on? He's speaking French to her, but she's replying in something that sounds like, I don't know, Swiss, German or Norwegian or something.

And afterwards I asked, I'm like, what language was she speaking? And he was like, oh, French, she's from Quebec. And I was like, I could hear your side of the conversation and understand it, but when she replied, I just had no idea, I was like, I can't- This sounds foreign to me. So, it's so funny how the brain does that, right?

It is. Yeah, it's you just broke it. But then after maybe it took me a- I think it took me from when I got here probably a good 6 months and up to a year to really understand and feel confident speaking in English or feel fluent, kind of fluent, and it took me probably the same amount of time to pick accent...

To be able to, like, differentiate?

Yeah, like I wish it didn't take me so long because I was working with a lot of Irish at that time. So, after a bit, I could probably make the difference. And then American got there and I was like, oh yeah, so that's not Australian, that's not Irish. Then I like, you know, just eliminating like, no, that's not, that's not. British is more like fluid and up and down, and like singing. So, you get it at some point, but it takes some time.

Yeah, it's crazy, isn't it? Like, as I- I imagine you'd be like that in France, where you would hear- I think France has dozens of different accents, right? And then there are all the different French speaking countries, and you don't realise how well tuned you are in your native language to pick up those accent differences where you're like, immediately, bam, that's from somewhere else.

And I can even, you know, at times, I'll be speaking with someone- Say there's a Brazilian woman who teaches English in the UK, and when I hear her speaking, I'm like, holy shit. She is almost 100% nailing the accent, but there's one or two things in there and I'm like, yeah, you're not a native.

And it's not even that she's mispronouncing sounds, it's that she's taken sounds from one sort of accent and brought them in, and she's pronouncing them correctly, but she's using them with the wrong kind of sounds for that, like they're not consistent.

It'd be like if I was pronouncing- Using American pronunciation at times when speaking Australian English, you would just be like, there's something weird going on here with his acc- It's not consistent. So, it is- It blows my mind. And that's one of those things I think that takes so long.

Like if I got back into French, it would probably take me years before I would be able to be like, listen to someone and instantly be like, yeah, he's from this place or that woman is from that place. Whereas, you know, I'm sure you can do it instantly, right?

Yeah, we can recognise that. And we've got already like the north and south of France, which north is a bit thicker accent than the south.

Is that the Ch'tis? Is that where they're from?

Ch'tis. Yeah. They're on another level, even higher.

Do, you want to explain the Ch'tis?

Oh, it's- I don't know. It's the, would that be like the Bush...?

Mountain people?

Mountain bush, the Australian version of France, I guess.

Yeah. But they have like a really, really unique, I think, dialect, right? Where it's not just accent, it's words, too, and...

Yeah, it's words and, yeah. I think even myself can't understand the words being said there, so. It's a mixed...

Have you seen much about Cajun French in Louisiana? I think it's Louisiana, in the US. So, they had a lot of French migrants, right? That's why this place is called like Louisiana and New Orleans.

They originally spoke French there. So, for since the 1600s since America was colonised, and it's this weird mélange of English and French. And they almost- When you hear them speaking, at least modern people speaking Cajun French, it sounds like they're just using an English accent, but they're speaking in French. And so, it's the weirdest thing to sort of...

I don't know.

...To watch and listen to, because it's just like...

Yeah, I need to have a look, I've never heard of it.

And they pull in so many phrases from, say, English, and it's just so mixed up. It's just nuts. But yeah, it's still, you know, there are still people there who speak this sort of, I guess it's a Creole kind of language where it has a backbone of French, but it's since, you know, absorbed a lot of English as well.

Yeah. I've never heard of it, and I'll have a look.

Yeah, yeah. Anyway, so how do you feel now after, I guess, 8 and a half years in Australia with your English before we move on to the other stuff? Did you ever get to sort of a point where it just plateaued and you're like, yeah, that's good enough?

Or is it the kind of thing where you're still working on it every day, you know, studying really hard? You know, what's that journey been like where you determine whether enough is enough or keep going?

Well, I think it's hard to say. I think there's always- I still make mistake in pronunciation or like writing and- I guess with time, usually I can correct myself, like, I'll do the mistake, then you're like, oh, that was wrong, and get back to it straight on. I've stopped studying, that's something for- I don't think it's the best solution... But like you said, I think it's- You get those waves of, like, it depends on who you hang with.

So, if I start hanging- So, I was doing the food van, but with my friends, working with French people, being with French. Your English go down straight away, like not necessarily in- I think your mind is getting a bit more confused with switching fast, even if you can do it. But then it's like, it's not as fluid as if you just hang with Australian people or English speakers...

Yeah.

...And you only think English, speak English, write English all the time. I had that for a year and a half for when I was in Perth, when I was only on the phone with friends and family speaking or writing French.

So, just surrounded by English speakers constantly.

Surrounded by English constantly. And I did feel it, like I was like, oh, like, I didn't have to repeat myself so often when I was chatting with people. Like, it was always more fluid with conversation at the coffee or anywhere.

And getting back here, like the last year and a half, almost it's I felt it the opposite way being like ahh! A bit harder. I need to repeat...

Because you're in Wollongong, right?

Yes, I'm in Wollongong, yeah.

And you have a business. The, I think, The Arrogant Snail?

Yeah.

Do you want to tell us a bit about that? And so, yeah, you're obviously surrounded by French speakers as well.

Yeah. Three French people in a food truck, a French van that we imported from France.

Wow. So, you drive around just Wollongong selling French food? Or is it you go around the country or...?

No.

Not yet.

It's a slow van. It's up to 70 kilometres per hour, so.

Really?

Yeah.

You guys have got to see this van, too. I'll have to try and share a photo of it because it was a- How did you find it? It looks like this really unique, beautiful old truck.

Well, we found it on a French website, so we got it from France, imported it to Australia.

Wow, okay. Jesus, that must have cost a lot.

Yeah, a bit, but I think it's been good so far. We got something a bit unique. There is some in Australia, not that many, but there are a few.

I would imagine they wouldn't be cheap here, though, you know, they'd be collector's items, right?

Yeah. And people keep them. So, people are either using them or keeping them, so.

And well it's, I don't know if you've seen The French Dispatch, the truck is in it.

Oh, really?

Yeah, yeah. The truck is in it. I saw some trailer of it, of the movie and...

They have the same one.

They have the same one. Yeah. So, yeah, we got that van and we just- We pause it a bit for winter and COVID, it's just been a bit of a hassle of trying to get that business running. So, we- It's on a brake at the moment, but. We were driving around just Wollongong and Illawarra, so that area out there and just selling crepe, galettes.

So, crepe and galettes. So, galette is the segregation of crepe, and creme brulée. And we've just been around and, I mean, people love the van, it's always a...

I think...

...Very curious and come around and...

There's always room for French cuisine in Australia.

Yeah.

Pretty sure you would have probably experienced that in Melbourne, right? Is it Flinders Lane that had that French restaurant or small French kind of creperie in there as well?

Yeah, the patisserie too, I think.

Maybe that was it. I remember there being a nice little place in there that was kind of tucked away.

Yeah, they got there and they had like a... I remember having a very nice patisserie chocolate pre- Chocolate factory there was very nice, like people were very like, they went full on with the stereotype. I think like we tried, like, very like, well-dressed, very trying to be as French as they could, so.

Does that irritate you?

No, no. I think, you know, there is a lot of truth in stereotypes.

I feel like if I were to go to France and, I guess, what would the equivalent be of what you're doing here in Australia? It would be someone selling, you know- I don't know. What?

Like pavlova out of the back of a ute in France and, you know, wearing thongs and, you know, being shirtless with a mullet or something, and people walking up and then being like, how the fuck are you? I feel like if I were to see that, I'd be like, oh, mate, you're doing us a disservice. This is not every Australian, guys. This should come with a warning label.

I think some French stereotypes are true. Like, it's- Like, to a point, I think...

Yeah.

...There is some truth in it. It's like that's coming from somewhere, and so...

Did you- Once you learnt English and obviously you were interacting with a lot more Australians over here, did you learn more about France and your own culture as a result and sort of like how it's seen globally? Like how Australians see France as opposed to obviously when you're in France and you speak French, you know, you can't really get that external kind of perspective.

Yeah. it all comes to a lot of all the time, what comes back a lot it's... I mean, in terms of stereotype, I would say, like arrogant.

That's not a stereotype. That's just true, isn't it?

That's true. Definitely.

Your business is called The Arrogant Snail.

That's definitely true. And I think it becomes like, when people like, know the cultures beyond, all of the...

Architecture.

...Architecture.

Yeah.

See, still making mistakes and learning. And that's always come back, like it's, oh, you've got so much culture, so much history. The food, the cheese, the wine. The wine is always a big one, you know, it's always like, oh, like, you're different, you pick up the wine.

We had some mum champagne the other day because my wife got her permanent residency...

Oh, cool.

...It was pretty good, but, yeah, very expensive.

Yeah. A lot of time, I guess, too.

To produce?

No, other... I thought you were talking like forever to get the PR.

Oh yeah, that took 3 years. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. That was- It was good to have that sorted finally.

Yes, definitely.

Awesome, man. So, tell us a bit about you travelling around Australia. You've ended up seeing probably more of Australia in the last two years than the average Australian, to be honest. And it's one of those embarrassing things, especially someone with an Australian business, and, you know, based on Australian English. A lot of the backpackers see so much of Australia so quickly.

So, how did you end up deciding that you wanted to do- To backpack around Australia and see these sorts of places? And you know, what was it- What was the preparation like?

Well, I think it started from- Like, there was always that idea to- A mix of project, of like, at first, it was mainly crossing the Simpson desert. So, that was like get the bike and crossing it with friends.

The motorbike, right?

The motorbike, yeah and crossing...

Wouldn't want to do that on a pedalling bike.

Well, some people do. There is a- There is actually an organisation there raising money for charity, I think, for kids, and they cycle with like a big, fat tire on a pusher bike across the Simpson. But they got like the four-wheel drive assistance...

Yeah, you'd hope so, right?

Yeah. Because they can only do- They can only do 80-60km a day, so. And it's 530km, I think, to cross it, so.

It's a week.

...Wouldn't be able to do it by yourself, I think. It would be very madness, pretty much. So, yeah, I started with that. I always wanted to go back in France, on a motorbike. That was a bit of a kind of dream or like a big goal I always had on the back of my mind, but I COVID often, and my goal was travelling country, full country, it's not something that's going to be easy to do, I think for a bit.

And like going back in France last year wasn't much of an option anyway because all the lockdown was happening. So, I was like, well, I might as well just spend some time and travel all around Australia. And I lived in Perth, and I've travelled all the south coast back to Melbourne, lived in Melbourne, so I explored around a bit of Victoria.

And I was a bit like, you know, looking at my option, I guess, and being like, it's winter on the East Coast and all that side of Australia. And I was like, let's go north, let's chase the sun into warm weather. So, I ended up, yeah, going through outback Queensland and north of WA and- But like through South Australia...

Through Alice Springs and everything, right?

...Alice Springs, then I was hoping to cross the Simpson on the way back for my trip, that was in September, beginning of October at that time and...

Just too hot.

Just too hot.

Yeah.

It was- You could still do it. Some people with four-wheel-drives were still going out there, but being a solo traveller on my motorbike, I have to carry an extra 16 litres of water and was just getting a bit too intense and too risky to just, you want to try to cross it...

So...

...I guess.

...Were you doing it 100% by yourself or was this in a group?

No, 100% solo. Solo-unassisted, yeah. So, that was fun.

How do you prepare for something like that? Because that must be a completely different game when you don't have assistance, and not necessarily assistance in that you have a car with stuff, but you've got someone else there just in case something goes wrong, right.

This is that kind of, you know, if you go swimming in the ocean, it's probably- And like away from shore. It's probably good to always have someone there with you because if you have a, you know, cramp or something. Yeah.

Well, it's- Yeah, I had- I wasn't thinking too much necessarily of that at the beginning. I was just planning and being like, it's fine. I guess not realising how much like Australia can be huge and the outback can be so very little population around. So...

I guess to put this in perspective, sorry, guys. So, Anthony went on a 109-day trip, 17,000 kilometres, 300 kilometres on foot, and it was 96 days camping out. So, it was a third of a year, right?

A third of a year, yeah. Yeah...

So, like 4 months.

Yeah, almost 4 months, camping and travelling around, yeah. I ended up getting a- What would they call it? Personal beacon?

Yeah. Yeah. An EPIRB, right?

An EPIRB, yeah. So, that was my only, like safety device, I guess, and I could get the best I could get, I think what was at that point was getting this device. And so, it's something that's tracking me, so my friends have access to the website and could check every day, like a little dot moving on the map, pretty much.

And if you get in trouble, you can hit a button, right, and the... (both talking)

...The rescue would come. So, you got 2 kind of options where you can either just send a text to your friends and it's just like the bike break down or I'm injured but I'm not going to die in the next 48 hours or whatever, you know, you just think it's not that important. And they- Your friends have to call someone around to organise the rescue for you. Or you press like the big S.O.S. red button it's like, come, come as quick as you can.

Yeah, the cavalry come, right. Yeah. Did you ever have to use it?

No, no. Luckily, no. I've never had to use it, no.

Ever come close? Or there- Was there ever a time where you were like, oh man, this is getting a bit much or I'm in a bit of danger here? Or was it smooth sailing?

...I think I had- No, I didn't get to the point. Like, literally never had to think about it. I think I was always being- And I guess being solo, I was always very conscious of the potential risk I was putting myself in every day.

Yeah.

So, there was time where I guess I would of probably, you know, maybe go a little bit faster or go a bit further away trying to in the bush or explore a bit more if I was with someone else. But being solo I was, I think, always a bit conscious of being like, well, the main point is to come back home alive. Just see as much as you can, not just trying to go places where nobody goes or...

So- Is that the sort of difficult side of doing it alone? I mean, I'm sure there's a sort of aspect of just isolation and loneliness that is probably part of the appeal. But is there also that lack of freedom for just being able to do whatever you want, whenever you want because you're on your own? So, you can't take certain risks that would otherwise potentially be okay if there were other people there.

And being on the motorbike, it's, you know, you fall, depends how you fall you can- I think you're very vulnerable. You expose yourself much more than being in a car, like your- All your risk- Like a car, you can- You're going to four-wheel drive trip or a van, you just load up.

You can get a 60-80 litres of water, it doesn't make any difference. Where for me, 10 litres was- 5 litres, where do I put them? It's a lot of weight, too hard on the bike. So, everything is the bigger proportion, than just being on the car, I guess.

So, how much strategically did you need to sort of plan these things out in order to make sure you had enough resources? Because, as you say, if you're doing this on a little motorbike, you sort of have to know where you can get water and food constantly, right, and fuel.

Whereas if you were just in some big fuck off huge four-wheel drive, you could pretty much, you know, almost drive, what, like a thousand kilometres without having to stop, and then, you know, have enough food and water for days.

Yeah, exactly. Well, it's- You start- I think I started with just picking up the bike and just realising how much weight I can put on, and by the set up, I could get like, you know, just a ton of room and weight, just define if... I ended up making the trip by knowing how much water and food I can carry more than making the trip and trying to fit the bike to the purpose.

Yeah.

So, I had that bug, I knew I could do- So, I did a big safari tank so I could carry 30 litres of fuel at the front.

How much-? How long would that last you?

With the front tank I could get 550km? -40km, 540km, which is pretty good for a motorbike.

Wow.

And I still had an extra 10 litres jerry can at the back.

That's good, like in case of forgetting to fill it or not enough petrol station, but as well like, I guess if I have a big fall, I have a big fall and I burst my tank, you know, for whatever, you know. I got that Jerrycan at the back where I can just do like another 100km to probably get back to the main road or get back to the closest town. And like, try to work something out from then.

But at least you can get yourself out of a shitty situation, pretty much. So, that's how I ended up setting up, I was like, I got a maximum of 3 one litres of fuel. And then from then just, you work your way out. So, every day through...

Yep.

...I did map out all the road trip before I left, so I took the map and do a little bit of research without pushing too much but just like, I can go that road, that way. My point was I wanted to cross the Simpson, go to the Kimberley and- So, Alice, Uluru, all these spots, going up to Darwin and then back. So, that's how I ended up mapping everything out.

Yeah.

And I was supposed to start with the Simpson, but at that time when I first left- I've been very lucky, and every time when I came back, people were like connecting with people there. So, I left a day before the lockdown happened in New South Wales, so I left Wollongong and rode on that day past the Blue Mountains and everything.

And at the same time, same night, my friends called me and was like, oh, did you realise, like did you see the news? South Australia is closing the border to New South Wales, WA is closing, Queen- Not Queensland. NT, WA they're all closing to New South Wales and my plan was to cross the Simpson, so I had to be going through South Australia. So, I was like, oh, okay, so I can't go there anymore already.

So, I was like, oh, I'm going to be stuck in New South Wales. The next day I ended up just jumping on the bike and Queensland was the last state I could go. So, I just drove 800km up the border, just across the border and save it. And I was like, Queensland is so big, even if I get stuck in Queensland I can just make a big trip out of it.

Yeah.

And that's where I ended up, yeah. I've done all my trip backwards and then what I thought I was thinking of doing the Simpson, then back up to WA and NT and coming back down.

But you did it backwards effectively.

I did it backwards, yeah. But I can't complain, like I still was still like in nature and travelling around where people were in lockdown, so, I mean...

I know, I kept seeing, that's why I was following it and I was just like, you son of a bitch. This was like, whilst Victoria was even worse, right, with lockdowns. On and off and on and off.

You had the worst time ever in from all the Australian people like how many...?

I don't know, 4 or 5 different lockdowns. But you look at how nuts it's going at the moment and your kind of like, in terms of numbers, if this was happening before people were vaccinated, it would have been a nightmare, right? Because the thing, yeah, that I see right now, all of the supply chains and everything is disrupted, and you're like, well, that would have happened.

So, even if we hadn't had a lockdown, we would have had massive problems with getting access to food and everything. So, it's almost like it was a, you know, he had to pick it between something- A rock and a hard place, right? So...

Definitely.

...But glad it's over.

Yeah, yeah.

So, which parts of the journey were the best, you know? Can you describe some of the stories or situations or things you saw whilst away?

The best, it's very odd, I think- You know, I think I was- In that time I was always so grateful to explore around and- It's very hard. Each state of territories got their own, like, scenery and they offer different exploration and- Like, for example, you get up to NT and it's that crocodile every waterway, you know? And that's- That took me a good week of, you know, watching the river or watching something and be like...

Holy shit, they're here.

They're here, there is crocodile in there, probably. And being on the bike again, you just need to be extra careful being like any crossing, any water crossing on the road, I was very conscious of like stopping, watching. Like, how deep is it? Am I falling in the middle or what? What if a croc is around? You know, it just- And when y- It took me a long time before, you know, it's- I think it's like sharks.

You know, people are very scared of shark, where- Because you don't know, if you don't know shark or if you don't know snake, any snake you see, it's scary. But if you know which one to be careful of and how to behave, you're not that necessarily that scared anymore.

Yeah.

Crocodile I was so unfamiliar, I was like...

It would be unfamiliar for me. I think the average Australian would be like, I don't know what to do.

What to do. Where to be careful. Is 50 metres enough? Like, where do I camp?

Have you seen that...?

...Camping...

Have you seen that video of the guys camping next to the- This river? And there's an American guy wearing an Akubra hat, and he's just like, so, we're going to show you how to check to see if there's crocodiles in the water. And there's a guy holding a buffalo head, right. Obviously, they've killed and butchered this buffalo and eaten it.

And he just swings it and throws it in the water, and the moment it touches the water, this huge like 4-metre croc just goes RRRRrrrrrr out of the water, just launches at it. And you're just like, holy shit, it was just waiting there the whole time...

Yeah.

...For any disruption of the water to just explode. And the guy on the camera is just like, well, I guess that's how you know, no swimming in here. That was just like, holy shit, you know, I would be packing my dacks the whole time, I think in the north of Australia like that. I'd be like, just stay away, 400-metres away from the waters edge.

Definitely. That's what I was thinking at the end. I was like, is that 400m enough? And I wanted to camp a few times, and I was just like...

Nup.

...Checking them up. Is there a river close by? You know, half past one, I don't even know, and...

You'll have to get a tent you can set up in a tree.

Exactly. Yeah. Like if you go to a roof, or a car you just sit, you're done. It's fine. But people in NT are very like, you know. I don't know. Just like, it's fine.

I think you get used to it though, right? Yeah. You're just like, you just stay away from the water. You can't go in any water, effectively, unless it's like isolated from the rivers and everything. Yeah, so.

Oh, there's a four-metre there. Okay, okay. Yeah. And like you said, like you don't see them and that was very impressive because in the north, close to Arnhem Land, you can go to what they call kelp crossing.

Yeah. This is where people are like fishing there, right?

Yeah.

They're just hanging out and you can see the crocodiles around, and you're just like, you guys are nutjobs.

It's crazy. And you can see them like disappearing, they just go down in the water and you're watching them for like 20 minutes, nothing's happened. And after 20 minutes, you just see the head popping up like a metre in front of you and he's been there the whole time.

Just to get a breath and then go back down.

And yeah, and you didn't know. And you're like, woah.

There was another video I saw that- From a sort of Australian bushman guy called Andrew Ucles, and there's- He goes to a river somewhere and he's just standing on a log, and I think they were spearing barramundi. And he just gets his camera and he's just like, okay, guys, so have a look around. And the water's really clear, it's beautiful.

And then he's just like, just as we were about to start spearing barramundi. He like, looks downwards, and there's this, you know, 3 and a half, 4-metre crocodile at the bottom of the water just sitting there like this... (crocodile pose) ...And it looks like a log through the water. You can barely see it. And he's just like, and we're not going to be spearing here today.

You know, I wouldn't go in the water. No, for sure.

So, yeah, how- What are some of the other amazing things that you saw? You know, like I imagine it would have been- There would have been so much wildlife running around. Did you get to see camels and stuff like that as well in the desert areas or...?

Oh, camel I didn't. Buffalo, snakes, some freshwater and saltwater crocodiles, that was- It was like at first same thing, you- I couldn't- I was like, oh, freshwater or saltwater, what do they look like? Very different and everything. The scenery is amazing. I think it's very- Like the sunset in the outback are so, so amazing.

Yeah.

...It's something- The night sky every night, it's something very different. The red dirt as well, like that was very, very, very shocking.

In terms of wildlife, yeah, definitely buffalo, crocs was the scariest things there, I guess, like for me, just being like- And you know, it's not like shark where, you know, it's just going to get a taste, maybe, and you're lucky you survive and you just- If you're lucky, you're just missing an arm or a leg. Like, you know, they're very vicious, and if they get you, you're done, you're over. Like, it's...

Yeah.

So- But many, like a lot of waterfall, canyon, hot springs in Limmen National Park, which is in NT. The scenery, it's always changing, I think. That was very changing all the time.

Do you think it's a much more intimate connection you get with the land, too, if you're on your bike as opposed to in a car?

Yeah, you- Well, you're much exposed to everything like the sun, rain, wind, so you feel it. The change of the road condition is a big thing. Like people were like, oh, sometimes it must be boring because, you know, it's outback, and in the bush, sometime it just very long, straight line of dirt road.

But the road conditions change a lot, so you've got outback sand or deep sand or gravel road. And when you're on the bike, that affects you much more than the car, so.

Does that get tiring, though? Because you must have to be so much more conscious of what you're doing, right? Like, you know, when you're driving, you're still conscious, but you don't have to be focussing on every single rock that you hit or the sand or the depth of the, you know, the sand that you're driving through.

Oh, it's physically and mentally you get exhausted. When I was doing- I realised that when I was doing over 300-400km of gravel road or outback road, I'd be very exhausted at night. Like, I'd just be like, I want dinner and go to bed and shower if possible because it just- And the thing is, on the corrugation road at the outback, you got to be- So, you've got to be at a certain speed, you can't be too slow.

Because if you're too slow you're just like...

(Too slow on a corrugation road)

Yeah, exactly.

You have to get to certain speed so that you time the jumps, right? You almost match the harmonics of the road so that the bike actually stays stable across the- Or the car as well.

Yeah.

If you're too slow, too fast, it starts vibrating like crazy.

And on a motorbike the sweet spot was 90-100km an hour.

Oh, wow, okay. So, you actually have to go pretty quickly.

So, you're going to have to go fast, so that's why it's so like, very full on because you've got to get to high speed...

Yeah.

...To just be comfortable and have a nice ride all day. But then you're like 100km trying to pick up rocks and pick up the next change on the road. So, it's very, very full on.

So, did you...

You got to follow like camping car and caravan, and four-wheel drives, so you get all the dust.

Oh, no.

I mean, it's always been like a good, I don't know, challenge and good day out of it, having a good time.

Did you have any falls on those roads or any crashes or anything or it was okay?

I had a few miss, a few near miss...

Near misses, yeah.

Yeah, I had one. Well, there was a huge ditch on the side of the road, and I was trying to make room for caravan coming across me, in front of me, so I went on the side of the road and there was this huge ditch. And I just ended up jumping it, jumping over from the road. So lucky, but. So, I got very scared on that one because I was just like 8:30-9:00am, I just left my camp, 10 minutes on the bike.

Yeah.

You know, just getting into it. And just like, whoa, slow down.

Jesus.

A few... A few near misses with, how do you call them, Brumbies?

Brumbies, okay, horses. Yeah, wild horses.

Wild horses in NT on a top roads, so...

As in them just coming across and just trying to...

...Crossing the road. Crazy.

Far out. I didn't think of that. Yeah, so you would have all these animals. Because that's one of those things that I would shit myself in a car, especially if it was a horse. But on a bike, you'd be dead.

You would be dead. Yeah, yeah. And I had the near-miss that day and I got there at the caravan park that same night and I was telling it to the owner, and he was like, oh yeah. Last week they took a guy on a motorbike, he's at the hospital in- I think, he was in Darwin because he like, nearly passed from the fall.

Far out. So, what were the people like, too? Did you get to meet some interesting characters whilst you're out there? Because I imagine that the- They're a different breed from those that you would meet in the city. And I don't mean that in like a negative way.

They're often, at least from my understanding, you know, they're much more informal, you know, and they're probably also straight for the- Straight to the point, you know, they're much less likely to put up with bullshit, you know?

And it's so like, I think, mainly North Territory, it just seems like they, you know, they got their own rules. It's a bit like the- It's wild, you know, just like people can do fireworks. I was there when they had North Territory Day, so it was like fireworks and- They just, yeah, I think they're just wild, they're just there in that- Their own with animals and with big bush land and vegetation where you could get lost and just-

They're just like, oh, yeah. It's the way, you know, like you- know, like not cowboy, I wouldn't say cowboy. But yes, it's a different lifestyle. Like, it's more farming and more people that live in isolation or very remote places, so they don't have the same attitude toward life, I guess, like it's very like, yeah, that's right.

Let's go, get some barramundi and- Like they were fishing around six crocs in that river at the crossing, you know, and on a tiny, tiny boat, like tiny dinghy. And you're like...

Most of the crops were bigger than the boat, you know...

Yeah.

...What are you doing?

I think you would just get so used to it, right? It becomes like this sort of, you know, you take it for granted and you don't realise how dangerous it is when you're around it all the time, which is when accidents tend to happen.

It does, yeah. But it's very intriguing place because it's, you know, they got both very 2 distinguished season of wet and dry.

Yeah.

So, I was there during the dry season.

Oh, you wouldn't be able to go through on the wet season.

No, you wouldn't. But it would still be very amazing to see, like all of those waterfalls that were probably going... half the capacity or not even of what they can go in wet season. That's something like I would love to go back and like go in a chopper and just have a look at those, like those big twin falls and it's changing falls in Kakadu, which is just amazing.

Like the- Yeah, it's just wild. And they keep it very- Like with all the Aboriginal community and everything, they keep it very like close to your country, go and venture around the park, which is looking good, like you just preserve all the environment around.

Yeah.

It's very- It's very amazing there.

I've heard a big issue is that the- That they do that, but they don't have enough funding to deal with all the pest species of plants and animals. And so, there's this kind of argument between whether or not, you know, it's a good idea to keep all these places like that isolated without people being able to go in.

You know, I don't know enough about it, but yeah, it is an interesting kind of thing because like- Especially in the NT, you don't realise how many invasive species are up there, especially the buffalo, which are a massive issue that they have to try and, you know, deal with, and donkeys and horses and- But you- So, you've also been on some cycling trips on actual bicycles, right?

Yeah.

...Recently, I think you did the Great Dividing Range in the south east and then you just got back from Tasmania, where you did 1,600 kilometres around the island.

Yeah.

How do you find the bike versus the motorbike?

There is some common- Some common things which like the weather, for example, whether you go much lighter than, you know, I thought I was very minimalist with travelling on the motorbike than when they want a push bike and it's even worse like it's- It's slower, it's good, I think it's physical, so you keep being fit and moving all the time and it's- it amazed me once I think it's about the distance, I guess.

So, you know, it was just, like you said, the distance, like, for example, crossing across the Tanami Road on the motorbike, so that's the road that goes from WA to Alice Springs. 1,000 kilometres, 800km without fuel, without fuel station, fuel service. And...

This is where you see that sign, is it? There's no fuel for the next- Yeah.

No fuel for next 800km. And you're like, oOh. And like, if you compare that to France, it's like...

That's the country, right? The length of the country.

From where I'm from, I can go to East Europe with the amount of fuel I had on the motorbike, like, it was just madness like how big Australia is. Like, it was, there were a places where I spend a couple days without seeing anyone. So, just 40- Almost 48 hours without- You don't see anybody. It's very...

What was that like mentally, though? I didn't really- I wanted to get to that for the big trip around Australia. You did 109 days effectively on your own. I mean, I imagine you had interactions with people here and there. But- And like, I don't know how good your phone reception was, either in terms of being able to call up family and friends, too. Was it a real battle mentally?

I think it's always challenging at some times, like it's depend on, you know? When you do- I think you ex- I expected it but, you... it's as well the challenge and the freedom I was looking for. It's like being on your own and doing those days without maybe without reception or like the choice to make by yourself and find out what you want or like, you know, it's-

Like, we were talking about risk taking or not, like it's- And just being your own responsibility, you know, you can't really check in and be like, am I being stupid or-? Or should I do it? Should I not? And...

Well, it must be pretty freeing as well, right? I imagine you don't have other people to worry about, you don't have family there. You don't have work. You don't have a phone constantly going off. You're not checking Facebook or Instagram.

Yeah. No, it's definitely more up and down, but there is a few down when, you know, you it's you can end up being like, oh, like, what am I doing here? Like, you know, I don't know. You always have, I think, both questions. Or sometimes it's more like about- When you travel solo, it's mainly the missing fact of not being able to share with people.

Yeah.

If you see something cool and you're like, oh, like, that's a lot, like a lot to talk about it with someone after or just being like, did you see that? Like, that's maybe more the dumb things I think about going solo, it's you're not able to share as much as you would like, but. On the other hand, being solo, you just need more people.

Yeah.

So, every time I was pulling up somewhere, people would come and...

Well, you must savour those interactions as well, right? And be like, oh my God, people. Let's have a chat. How are you? Where are you from? What's going on? How's your mother?

And people were so kind, like people were offering me like, you know, either like, oh, you must be exhausted. Do you want a cold beer? Do you want veggie? Do you want dinner? Do you want to eat with us? Or like firewood for the night? Like every night it was like- I think, the first week I cooked once or twice...

Wow, okay.

...And every other time was people inviting me for dinner.

Yeah.

That was like amazing. That was so, so good.

So, how would you suggest to people listening to this and thinking, you know- And this is something that I sort of suffered from when I was watching, you do this, I'm like, fuck. I would love to be able to do these sorts of trips. But oh man, I could never do it. I could never do it, you know, family aside, all of that sort of thing. I'm just like, why?

Just, you know, I don't know how bikes work. I don't know how to repair them. I'm sure I wouldn't be able to handle it. You know, what are the kinds of things that you would say to someone who would love to do it but thinks they couldn't? You know, how would you prepare for something like this? And can the average person do it?

I think so. Like, I got some, I think it was like some positive from my side doing mechanics, so I wasn't that scared about breaking down in the middle of nowhere pretty much because. Well, there's things I can fix and stuff I can't.

But I guess you've got to trust the- Like I say, I got the locator beacon on me, so that was my safety net and I felt like, you know, if you take enough fuel- I always had the same mindset, it's like, I have my credit card and money to buy stuff if I need to. I had my safety device and I've got enough water and food to last few days.

And from then- I mean, the chance of, like, I guess something bad and dying out there is very little. But if you restrain those things, then after anyone, I think anyone can do it. You'll always meet people, you know, people are very friendly. If you break down on the side of the road, you got like 90% of chance, 99% of chance I would say that people are going to stop and help you out, you know.

I would stop sometime just to have a drink, have a snack and people would stop, do you have enough water? Do you have enough food? Do you want to have fruits? Do you want something? So, it's- And even more being in the outback there, it's- People knows what it's like, so they help each other. You know, you may stop for someone, and that someone might stop for you 100km further.

Yeah...

So, it's...

What goes around comes around.

Yeah, exactly. So, I think everyone can do it. Like I've met people, like I met a woman who was travelling on a motorbike. Very good stories, she is, good and sad her parents passed away last year or 2 years ago, and she found out their diary...

Oh, no.

...And they've been travelling around Australia 20 years ago.

Yeah.

And she's doing the same trip. So, they've been documenting everything every day with picture and everything. And she's been doing that on a motorbike...

Whilst with her being able to compare with her parents...

She's just following the diary, like day by day, almost.

Wow.

...Knowing that full things. And she's got no mechanical skills, she just left with a tent, and I think- I can't remember. She must be about her fifties, I think. And it's just amazing. Like...

Wow.

So, I'm not the only one. I can sometimes, like almost feel like, you know, that I'm cheating the- I'm like, oh, I've got the skill to fix the motorbike. I'm not that scared about that, and I'm more like, you know, impressed by people like her doing it when, like if something happened, they just don't know.

Yeah.

Well, what can I do? Like I can- There is only so little I can fix, but they still go. So, I think it's taking the chance and going for it.

So, what can people do, though, to prepare for a journey like this? Is it the kind of thing where, you know, obviously learn the basics about how a motorbike functions so that if, you know, you can fix whatever you can fix, if possible? But then do you need to learn things about, you know, food and rationing and obviously map reading and everything like that to try and get prepared as best as you can?

Yeah, I think it's like any travel in a journey when you do those big trip it's- You can't really plan everything because it's all going to change.

Yeah.

Like I will- What I will do is sit up in my tent every night and plan my next day. So, I would like, if I was feeling like doing 200km, I would just do 200km and maybe stop there and there and check a waterfall, check a canyon or- Or then you meet people and people are like, oh, you should go there, like, it's- Or maybe, pass that one because it's not that suitable.

And in terms of food, you just, you know, it's like you keep- I always had like a day or two of like tuna and very dry food to make sure I could just break down anywhere and have some food.

Yeah.

And then from there you just, you know, just up to the shop, you go to- That's where it's a bit different from the pushbike coming back to Tasmania, where you would be more limited with that. Like you can't just drive 50km out of your direction to go to the shop, you know, because 50km it's already half a day or even more, right...

Yeah.

So, it- There is always a bit of planning, but I think you can sort it out and just pick them up. Where is the shop? Next shop. Next fuel.

Yeah.

Get your food and get on.

Is that normally on the map, too? You'll have that just marked there, the shops and the food places and everything or?

Well, most of small towns I go to, you know, a little IGA or a general store or...

Yeah.

...You can... or a service station like or at least something that can help you out. It's not going to be any French food. Most of the time you'll get rice or those tuna-something, you can just pack, doesn't matter about the weather and the conditions or- That's what I've been living on for a while or what, just like eating, you know, rice, pasta, tuna, dry food, pretty much.

And every time I'll get somewhere where I could have some veggies and fruits or like even just a bit of meat that would go through the to the pub and buy a beer and have a pub meal and off I go again, so that's great.

Awesome, man. Well, what's next?

Back to work.

So, there's no other trips coming up in the- Or are you planning something in, you know, the near or distant future at all?

No, no. I mean, there is always many trips.

Yeah.

I've learnt going to Tasmania that you can cross the bus trail on a kayak, so. I don't know.

Yeah.

That's something that seems very cool to me now, but...

I interviewed; I think his name was Beau Miles. Have you seen his channel?

Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. He's got a four part, I think, a four-part series of him doing it. Yeah. That's...

I watched it this week.

Yeah, that's intense. So, you're thinking about doing that, are you?

I mean, like, I've been watching it this weekend because I was on somewhere on The Spirit (of Tasmania) and I was like, oh, that looks cool. But that might be- That might not be- No, no. I'll be working, going back to France hopefully this Australian winter, somewhere in France to see all the families and everybody.

God. That freedom must feel good with citizenship in Australia, where you're just like, I don't have to worry about visa bullshit when I come back in, if I can, if I can't.

And spend time away, like, because all those visa, all the time I got the visa, you can't spend more than...

That's right.

...2 months-something, 90 days...

Yeah.

...Outside the country, so.

Yeah.

It's, yeah, the freedom, the weight off the shoulders to get, once you get even just the PR, I guess. Like, it's- Because the citizenship is just a small- Compared to the investment for the PR, just a small step.

It's not small. We spent $10,000 on it, paying the fees and getting a lawyer to do it. We waited 3 years and it just kept getting delayed. My wife had to do the medical exam and that took a year because of the COVID lockdowns. It just kept getting delayed and delayed and delayed.

Or she had her period and they'd be like, yeah, you can't do it because you're on your period. And you're just like, fuck me, man. It's the last step. It's the last goddamn step. Just let us smash it out.

It's crazy. Well, once you get there, the citizen, it's... You got the test, but it's pretty...

Basic.

Basic, yeah. Pretty much. And then you're done and it's, yeah, it's a good, good feeling like. Can she have both citizenship?

Yeah, I think Brazil is fine as far as I know, yeah, she should be able to have dual citizenship.

Because I think some countries can't get there like...

Yeah, I'm not sure which ones. I've heard that though, where you are forced to give one up. You know, I think- I don't know if Canada's like that. Yeah. There's some interesting rules out there for certain places. And I've got a dual citizenship with the UK, although I've never been there.

Because my mum was born there on a holiday, so ironically, being born there, when you're from the Commonwealth, you automatically get citizenship. So, yeah, it's funny. How did you end up in Wollongong? You know, to sort of finish up here. I remember you were in Melbourne for ages, but yeah, you've sort of settled there, which- And this is just south of Sydney by an hour or 2, right?

Yeah, an hour south of Sydney.

Yeah.

Well, after Melbourne, I ended up going for work in Perth, in WA, then I spent a year there, then- Which is my job, then followed the sorts of spots. Then my best friend always lived in Wollongong, and what was supposed to be just kind of a stopover and keep going up the East Coast and check Brisbane and Cairns ended up being like, I think 3 years now. 3 years I've been here...

Yeah. How does it rate? Is it better than Melbourne? You enjoying it?

Yeah, I think I'm not a city person, so I think Wollongong is a good compromise between like the coast, the Blue Mountains, Sydney, when you want to go and take the international airport. So, it's been good, I think, and from seeing what I've seen around from Australia and Tasmania, I'm pretty happy with what Wollongong has to offer so far.

So, that's a big deal. That was as well, I guess, a point of travelling around Australia is to keep checking if there is somewhere else I would rather live than Wollongong, Melbourne or Perth, so. But Wollongong it is, for I don't know. A bit, I don't know. Maybe 3 years, we'll see.

Awesome, dude. Well, Anthony, thanks so much for coming on, and you'll have to keep us posted. You'll have to let us know if you find somewhere better than Wollongong, Melbourne, or Perth. Share it with us. But thanks, mate, and we'll have to have you on again in the future.

No problem. Good to see you.

Cheers.

See ya, man.