Transcript of AE 1108 - Interview: Farofa, Japan, & Cultural Identity with Kyrin Down

G'day, you mob. Pete here, from Aussie English. Welcome to this episode, this is part three of my mini-series with Kyrin Down from the Mere Mortals podcast. Today, we talk about wishing we could live in other places besides Australia.

Europe versus Australia, so what it's like to live somewhere in Europe, where you're surrounded by many different cultures and languages compared to somewhere like Australia, where it's pretty much just the same culture and language. Obviously not including the indigenous cultures and languages. Globalisation and how you can buy pretty much any foreign food in Australia, and if you can't, you can have it sent here.

You can buy it online and have it sent here. Japan, how different it appears from Australia and wanting to learn more about it, living there, learning the language, etc. How anyone of any race or language or cultural background can come to Australia and effectively be seen as Australian as soon as they get their citizenship.

Whereas other countries like China and Japan, it's pretty much impossible to end up a European who lives there and is considered by the local people to be just like them. And we also talk about native peoples' reactions to foreigners speaking their language, and how English speaking peoples around the world don't tend to have those sorts of reactions when foreigners speak English. Anyway, let's get into today's episode.

I would like to try living in somewhere like Europe for a little bit, just to see what it's like to be like, oh, I want to go to France. Okay, I'll take the train over. You know, I'll swim the channel.

Well, I can't imagine the outlook you would have on life in just- In terms of just these things at your fingertips? Like, I live in France, but I can travel to, I don't know. What are they surrounded by? 27 different countries in Europe and it's less than, what, 12 hours flight to probably all of them, you know, every single one of them.

Yeah, yeah, exac- Well, not even that, man...

Yeah.

...5 or 6 hours, probably.

Yeah. But that's what blows my mind, and the fact that you can just drive, you know, across the border and be in another country with another culture with another language. And a bunch of these countries have multiple languages. You know, I can't imagine going to Switzerland and it's like, yeah, they've got three languages. Oh, and everyone speaks English as well...

Yeah.

...You know, like, Jesus. You know? It must be so interesting growing up in Europe and how- It would be interesting to know more about how they see themselves culturally. Do you become more of a global citizen as a result of being surrounded by so many other countries?

Or do you end up becoming more insular and internally focussed and like culturally proud of whichever country you come from because you're surrounded by all these kind of competitors? Whereas Australia, it's kind of like, what's the next closest country, Papua New Guinea and Indonesia or, you know, New Zealand as well. We're kind of like...

Yeah.

...There's no real competitiveness, right? It's just, eh, they're there.

For sure, man, for sure. I always find it weird when I think- Like, I'll see stuff in the soup- I heard this one recently, so it's about food related and they were saying, what- You know, why is the food in Japan so good? And if you haven't been to Japan, like it's really good. Like the food- I didn't have a meal where I was like, oh, you know, like pick up an apple or a banana, and it's like, oh, this is, you know, a little bit, blegh.

Like, what's the point of eating this? And apparently their food is all really seasonal, like the way that they eat is just super seasonal, so you won't get- Be able to get an apple all year round.

You can only get it in the apple season for when apples are good. And I was thinking like, man, yeah, that sort of relates here because there's certain times of the year where you just eat and it's such a- So, like it's- Like a gross apple, you get it, you bite into it, and you're like, ew...

Tap out.

...Buy this thing.

Yeah, I'll be back in a few months, guys. Let's see how the harvest is then.

Yeah, yeah. And yeah, I was just think- Like, thinking of all the crazy things you can get over here, you know, if you really want to, you can find Colombian chips. You know, they're almost the same as chips from here, but it's like Colombian, so people love it.

And it's just like, wow. Like the amount of effort to get that thing all the way from there over to here and just for it to be consumed, you know, instantly is ridiculous.

Well, there's a whole bunch of that happening with Brazil at the moment. My wife found this company, I've forgotten the name of them. So, sorry guys, for no shout out. But there was a- It's an Instagram page about food from Brazil, and they get it sent over here within 10 days.

So, if you order it, it comes from Brazil, I think, you know, and it's like- Like, it's a bit- I don't know if it's really, really expensive or if it's just a little bit expensive. I didn't ask for the prices, but it is pretty crazy.

It's good for getting the things that are really difficult to get, that are unique to Brazil. So, I think one of them is like... (speaks Portuguese) ...Which Kel is obsessed with, which is cassava flour. And it's often flavoured, you know, like bacon and onion and other things in it.

And it's just really good as a condiment next to rice and... (speaks Portuguese) ...Which is like, what would you say? Beans, black beans and meat. It's really good, but it's impossible to find here because they don't have cassava as a, you know, a plan for anything growing here.

So, it is cool that's opening up. But yeah, Japan must be such an interesting place because I don't know how like open they are to foreign foods. They seem like such an interesting culture and country, I would love to- I think if I had another life, I would try and learn Japanese and probably travel to Japan, try and live there for a long time and sort of get to know the place.

But it seems like it's just- It must be such a mind fuck going to Japan and just being like, this place is so technologically advanced, they're just- And the culture of priding themselves upon quality appearance, you know, ritual and the history of the language and everything.

It must be so interesting. But at the same time, you have the darker sides of the culture where, you know, there are really, really high suicide rates and people aren't having children, the population's getting older and they're not sure what they're going to do with it. So, yeah, it must be so interesting.

And the fact that you can never really- Like coming from Australia, it's really interesting when you think that anyone can effectively come here and if they were given a citizenship tomorrow, at least I, probably you, probably the average Australian would be like, you're an Aussie now, like, you're one of us. You know, I may be a native speaker of English, Australian English, but you're as Australian as I am, effectively.

I'm just, you know, heritage-wise, a few hundred years ahead of you in terms of how long we've been here. But with countries like China and Japan and Korea, it's really interesting where you can- You could be a white dude living there for 50 years, you could probably have even been a white dude born there, you know, with potentially even Japanese citizenship, you know, with a passport, but they would look at you like, you're not one of us.

Like, effectively, there's no, you know, there's no white Chinese person that's like, yeah, the Chinese see me as Chinese. It's like, that's not going to happen.

Yeah...

This culture is thousands of years old, and it very much identifies itself with the race, you know, as well, I believe.

For sure. And it's kind of funny when you think of, you know, there's all those videos of, you know, white guy goes to Japan. I think there's one guy. Matt?

Matt versus Japan. Yeah, he's...

...Japan.

...He's very switched on for you, guys, who want to see someone who speaks Japanese very well.

Yeah. And he will go there and then, you know, like classic, like, check out this reaction and they're blown away. I was just thinking like, just imagine anyone else coming to- Like an African guy coming to Australia, and he speaks perfect English, it would just be like, no...

Yeah, I know. It's funny, isn't it? Because it's almost like bigotry of low expectations where I think the average Japanese person, because the rest of the world doesn't learn Japanese, you know, to the extent that it learns English. If they do, if- I can't imagine if, you know, you live in this small island in Asia and some white dude appears behind you and speaks Japanese like a Japanese person, you would be like, this is a rarity.

Like, I don't see this every day. But yeah, I can't imagine being in Australia and just being at the market and there's some, you know, African- Guy of African heritage doing a selfie video, and he's just sitting there going, yeah, do you guys want to go to the servo and get some Winnie Blues? And I'd turn around and I'm just like, holy shit, there's an African guy here who speaks English.

You know, like, I can't imagine ever having my mind blown. You know, I would just be like- I'd probably be impressed. I'd be like, wow, this guy- Like, I think on first seeing this person, I would think they're probably a recent immigrant because African immigrants are relatively recent, you know, 90s onwards.

And so, a lot of them have some kind of a foreign accent, but there are- I'm starting to interact with way more people from Africa who have been born and raised here and speak with an Australian accent. And so, it's becoming very, very, very normalised really quickly.

Like, I think my grandparents would probably still be shocked if someone walked up to them who is, you know, Nigerian, sort of African black and was just like, yeah, how's it going mate? You know, they'd probably be like, wow.

But I can't think of any other examples, you know, of people coming from a certain country and then speaking Australian English, and I would have my mind absolutely blown, right, to the point where I'd be like, your race doesn't speak my language. You know?

Yeah, yeah. And even- I have seen like- And it's not just in English as well. I can't imagine the same thing happening in France or Germany or...

Yeah.

...You know, Italy or places like that. Maybe you could get the same sort of reaction if you went to, you know, the Congo, like, or something like that if you're Asian or Caucasian...

And I think it's different, though, right? Like, I think with somewhere like France, when I was learning French in France and spoke pretty well, I'd sort of nailed a lot of the short phrases, and so pronounced them really clearly and sounded French.

And it would almost be the sort of inverse where as soon as I started indicating that I was not French, they would be really impressed and kind of like, wait, what? You're Australian? You know, and you would be like, yeah, yeah. And they'd be like, oh, wow, like, we're not used to foreigners speaking French with a really good accent, you know? So, it was almost an inverted kind of thing.

It's the same with Portuguese in Brazil, I'll be speaking Portuguese, and again, I'm not sort of patting myself on the back to say I'm really, really good. But I'll say the standard sort of phrases that you can get out quickly, and that are common, and you can nail the pronunciation of and then as soon as they realise, you're Australian, they kind of almost like, oh my God. You know, wow, you can speak...

I've had those reactions here. So, you know, Colombians in Australia where they're not expecting, I guess, the Spanish to come out and it's like, whoa. Like, I got so many more compliments here than I ever did there. And my, you know- Yeah, it's hard to argue.

I'd say my levels are like similar. I was practising more there, but now I've had more time to refine certain aspects. I would say, like my Spanish is still like the same-ish level. But yeah, yeah, way more better reactions here. One thing...

(both talking) ...I never know whether to be offended, because I'm like, so wait, you wouldn't expect someone from Australia to be, you know, good enough to learn French. Like, is that what you're saying? Or...

Nah, I think it's more just like the surprise part, and it's like, well, why- You know, why would you bother to like, learn French when you're in Australia? Like you're not even close. That sort of thing.

That's that two-edge blade, right? That gift and a curse thing, too, for Westerners who speak English as their native language, it's always like- But there are so many options for a foreign language to learn, and they all have nowhere near the same kind of gravity, gravitational pull as English would have for all other languages and countries and cultures, right?

In terms of it being a really important thing to learn for them jobwise, travel-wise, whatever it is.

And that's the hardest thing for like learning Portuguese, it's kind of like you're going from English where you've got effectively the largest quantity of cultural material in the world to a smaller country that has much, much less, right. Like you have to kind of niche down and dive into the literature and everything else that they've done.

Whereas you can't, you know, just get on Netflix and be like, I have a thousand TV shows that I can pick from.

Yeah, yeah. And or like, you know, this is relevant news, this is stuff that could actually affect me. Whereas, you know, nothing much that's happening in Latin America is going to affect me. Maybe some of the stuff in El Salvador with bitcoin, but, yeah, other than that.

I was going to say one of the like clearest memories for me was, I was in Japan in I think it was Harajuku, which is like one of the- Or Roppongi, sorry, and which is like one of the big party areas, I guess, particularly for tourists.

And we went there and we like stayed up most of the night, and then it was like, all right, well, let's just catch the subway back, it opens up in half an hour. And so, they have like this subway classic like staircase descending into the bowels underneath sort of thing.

And they had a gate midway there, and so there's like me, one, a friend of mine, Joey, and then just a bunch of other stragglers who are all, you know, had a big night out. We're all still tipsy, we're all just like grungy from, you know, sweaty from dancing. It's starting to rain, so it's starting to get wet and whatnot.

And we go down, like, finally, the gates open, we go down, we're waiting for the first train, and we look across the other side of the platform and it's like the most elegant lady I've ever seen in my life. She was, you know, dressed up in like this fantastic sort of- I don't know what you'd call it. Like a pantsuit type of thing, just like cream coloured, spotless, hair done up, you know.

And it's like 4:00am in the morning and I'm on the other side, just dungy, like dirty surrounded by all these travellers. And, you know, it was just like one of the moments in my life where I was like, man, we are living in different worlds. Like we're in the same spot here, but you are living such a different life than me.